Hello everyone, I harvested my elk b tag tonight here in Montana and the 210 berger absolutely ruined a whole shoulder and looked like it sucked stomach matter out of the entrance hole. There was stomach matter between the hide and the entry hole. The shot was 540 yards slightly uphill slightly quartered to me and I hit tight on the pocket and took out hits heart and lungs. She ran 15 yards downhill and I think the only reason she made it that far was because it was such a steep downhill. I didn’t take any pictures to show the results as light was fading fast and we had a long way back to the truck. I have killed many many elk and watched many more get taken and I have never seen anything like it. I know fluke things happen but has anyone else had this experience with 210 vld hunting bullets? Rifle is a christensen ridgeline chambered in 300 win mag and shooting the 210’s at 3050 fps. Is my velocity too fast? I have only shot them for two seasons and this will be my sixth animal with them but I hunt for food and I can’t have that but they shoot so dang accurate it’s hard not to use them. Thanks! Also when we gut her the diaphragm and everything had no pieces of the bullet or anything going through it. I’m literally in shock at what I saw tonight.
210 berger destruction?
- Thread starter Elkhnter5
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I obviously was not there to witness this but what you are describing and what I am picturing I have seen and it has absolutely nothing to do with the bullet but the fact that the animal had hole in its side. Some times it happens. Sometimes it stays inside.
Broz
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We have taken dozens of elk with the 210's and most from a 300 win mag. Although your velocity does seem pretty high for a 210 from a 300 win mag, I dont think it is a factor. I would not be too concerned about one sample when it seems you have many others without question. No two shots are ever the same. Placement, animal condition, bone muscle mass, entrance angle, animal angle etc will all play a role.
I have said this for years, and I still believe it today. Shot placement and impact velocity is what ruins meat. Way more so than bullet construction.
I have said this for years, and I still believe it today. Shot placement and impact velocity is what ruins meat. Way more so than bullet construction.
I am running 78.5 grains of retumbo with the bullets seated out to where they barely fit in the magazine. They extract easily and there is just a slight ejector mark on the case head but if I need to back them off I definitely can do that. Jeff I was hoping to hear from you and Ryan as I know both of you harvest a lot of animals and that you guys use bergers a lot. I will keep trying them and not rule them out yet. As you stated, this is the first time it has happened so I still don't think I have enough samples of harvests to rule anything out. I thought maybe it was because I was getting so much velocity out of them and the 1-10 twist with christensen might have something to do with it. I normally try not to hug the shoulder and shoot broadside shots but with this being the only elk we had seen all season and the only opportunity I took the shot. I might just have to wait for a broadside shot and slow them down a little bit. I appreciate your time for the response. Happy hunting to both you and Ryan!
What velocity have you found to work best for the 210 bergers? I can try to work a load to find that velocity after this season and shoot my other rifles for the remainder of the year if need be and you think that would make a difference.
Broz
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As stated I do not feel your velocity was the problem. But it is pretty high for the combo. That said some rifles will run there but they are few and far between. Most 300 win mags with 210's and H-1000 come in closer to 2900 or a bit more.
I would not worry about it. Go hunting and try to stay off the shoulders if you wish to retain as much meat as possible. Ribs to ribs for the win.
Thank you for your time and your advice! I will stay off the shoulders for sure!
Broz
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I totally understand we may have to take the best shot that is presented. Just know any bullet that hits thick meat and bone will likely result in meat loss. But this is why they work so well. They are destructive. We just need to keep them in the vitals when we can if we desire to save meat.
Another way to look at it would be the animal was down quickly on a quartering shot. Some bullets may have not offered that. Some meat loss is a lot better that a lost animal and 100% loss. Elk are tough, destroyed vitals are king at putting them down asap.
100% agree! Just had never seen a bullet do that before. I am a believer in not wanting the animals to suffer and so far since switching to Berger bullets I have watched everyone drop either within 30 yards of impact or right on the spot. I have yet to have a blood trail but if they are dying that fast that doesn't bother me much. The fact that they are so accurate also makes me feel certain at my ability to put it where it belongs to get the job done.
Gord0
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I used to shoot 165gr Barnes at about 3200fps in my win mag for whitetail. Not a super destructive fragmenting bullet like a Berger at all. I had a nice 8 a little more than quartering away at a trot at 75yds. I put it just behind his shoulder trying to save meat... Every last bit of that shoulder was bloodshot, it was dislocated, had a huge hole in the ribs, and most of his heart got sucked out the exit. Every shot on every animal is different. Aim for the ribs and hope for the best!
For sure! I try to stay off the shoulder as best as I can but being taught by a hold right on the crease father it’s hard sometimes to hold back a couple inches. I understand every bullet has bloodshot and this was the only elk we had seen that provided a shot and the wind was right at them so I took a quartered to shot (which some say is terrible with berger bullets) and I watched the impact hit that shoulder and she spun and went about 10 yards and tipped over. I used to believe in needing an in and out hole (nosler partition and accubond style bullets) which are great bullets but after seeing the insides of animals shot with bergers I was impressed. I lost a shoulder and I would’ve lost a shoulder with any other bullet I shot with where I hit her maybe even the other one with a bullet that exited. Like you said and Jeff mentioned earlier, every shot and angle and density of every animal is going to be different. You could shoot 10 animals at the same distance and have a broadside shot and hit them in the same spot and most likely get several different results using the same bullet. I’m not going to rule them out and Jeff kills more animals in a year than most do in a lifetime with his rifles and if he’s shooting berger there is a reason. I think they do help with poor shot placement because they are so destructive. I have yet to have a poor shot with them knock on wood. Thanks for input guys I appreciate it. Happy hunting!
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